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Source Location: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pjrv/
Filetype: Archive. Topic: Remote Viewing. Blocked: by topic detail.
Archive Storage: www.firedocs.com/pjrv/ and http://www.dojopsi.info/pjrv/
Archivist: Palyne PJ Gaenir (PJRV, Palyne, Firedocs RV, TKR and the Dojo Psi.)



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pjrv : Messages : 643-653 of 4038
(http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pjrv/messages/643?)
22:15:06
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#643

From: "liansidorov71" Date: Sun Sep 8, 2002 4:54 pm Subject: putting the left foot out the door liansidorov71 Hello everyone, I am very new at RV and I'll have to admit up front that under normal circumstances I shouldn't be allowed to join his forum (see below). However, I guess PJ was in a particularly generous mood this week-end and she "let me in on a sports scholarships " (or rather, I got on the team because of academic credentials? I run the www.emergentmind.org site and its journal, and, why hide it, I just begged shamelessly...) Anyway, I am very grateful to you all for the opportunity - at least until you decide to kick me out ;-) Since the primary purpose of this group is to discuss practice problems (and keeping in mind that I haven't yet had a chance to take RV instruction with a monitor), can I ask a silly 101 question? I've only done about 10 sessions so far, and I find that most of the time I manage to get a correct primary impression/ideogram - but after this first contact my brain starts immediately to feed me AOLs and from that point on I can't "get out" of this scenario. For example, yesterday I did a target on the Boundary Institute website: I imediately got "triangle" and "sticks" - "trangle on vertical sticks" gestalt. Then I separated from the signal line momentarily to write this down, and my brain immediately started looking for something that would fit this, and came up with an Ikea-type triangular table on three legs! From that point on everything seemed to feed into this and I started "seeing" a cafeteria type setting with many such tables, even an electrical outlet/cord coming at me from the wall (which on feedback turned out to be a black metal lantern hanging from the ceiling). The target, by the way, was a low- angle view of a portico - the triangular "roof" supported by a large number of columns ("sticks" - ha!) The scoring on this particular target came back as 78/100, but what good is that if I jam my system with the wrong data from stage I? The problem is that I find this pattern to be almost invariable with me - I know I'm not supposed to look for or accept any conceptual conclusions or comparisons, but once my mind comes across one I just can't rid myself of it. Please help! ;-) Lian Sidorov Reply | Forward

#645

From: "Viv*" Date: Sun Sep 8, 2002 7:15 pm Subject: Re: putting the left foot out the door eclecticviv Lian: First off, want to say your sub feeds you the right data. Sometimes we loose the meaning in the translation, to the conscious side. As for the aol's or stray cats. They are permissible, just not to be taken literally. Next time you get a stray cat, write it down. When your done with your session, break down that stray cat into descriptors. You might find the descriptors are right on for describing the target, whereas the straycat had nothing to do with it. As for working with a monitor, that can be considered a luxery. If you ever take formal RV lessons, you'll get a monitor at least a couple of times to know what it is about. After that, most of us practice with a tasker, or someone who sets up the target sesson but doesn't guide, in person. If you can find a friend who wants to learn RV along with you, perhaps you can trade off playing the monitor roll. Viv* On 8 Sep 2002 at 21:54, liansidorov71 wrote: > > Hello everyone, > > > > I am very new at RV and I'll have to admit up front > that under normal circumstances I shouldn't be allowed > to join his forum (see below). However, I guess PJ was > in a particularly generous mood this week-end and she > "let me in on a sports scholarships " (or rather, I got > on the team because of academic credentials? I run the > www.emergentmind.org site and its journal, and, why > hide it, I just begged shamelessly...) Anyway, I am > very grateful to you all for the opportunity - at least > until you decide to kick me out ;-) > > > Since the primary purpose of this group is to discuss > practice problems (and keeping in mind that I haven't > yet had a chance to take RV instruction with a > monitor), can I ask a silly 101 question? > > I've only done about 10 sessions so far, and I find > that most of the time I manage to get a correct primary > impression/ideogram - but after this first contact my > brain starts immediately to feed me AOLs and from that > point on I can't "get out" of this scenario. For > example, yesterday I did a target on the Boundary > Institute website: I imediately got "triangle" and > "sticks" - "trangle on vertical sticks" gestalt. Then I > separated from the signal line momentarily to write > this down, and my brain immediately started looking for > something that would fit this, and came up with an > Ikea-type triangular table on three legs! From that > point on everything seemed to feed into this and I > started "seeing" a cafeteria type setting with many > such tables, even an electrical outlet/cord coming at > me from the wall (which on feedback turned out to be a > black metal lantern hanging from the ceiling). The > target, by the way, was a low- angle view of a portico > - the triangular "roof" supported by a large number of > columns ("sticks" - ha!) The scoring on this particular > target came back as 78/100, but what good is that if I > jam my system with the wrong data from stage I? > > The problem is that I find this pattern to be almost > invariable with me - I know I'm not supposed to look > for or accept any conceptual conclusions or > comparisons, but once my mind comes across one I just > can't rid myself of it. Please help! ;-) > > Lian Sidorov > -- A billion here, a billion there, and pretty soon you're talking about real money. ~Everett Dirksen~ Reply | Forward

#648

From: aeonblueau8008... Date: Sun Sep 8, 2002 5:56 pm Subject: Re: putting the left foot out the door terri8008 Lian.. very nice name. (IMO) Your stuck in S1. (lotsa folks are-an forever are) initial gestalt, actually totally normal. Very/highly common normal run o'the mill quote unquote problem(or not). Then comes "like".. then comes declaired AOL or usually drive.. Many newbies or self taught or whatever get.. stuck here, check out public posted sessions.. most folks stick here. If working ERV style find a monitor(ERV is after all is all about moving folks about), if working CRV style. get training and some basic structure to boot scoot you along. Structure is a key word. (everything for a reason) HRVG offers one heck of a lot of structure for free I think.. you might have to sign your life away in the process.. or was it sign your name in blood. (JOKE!!) The rest is discipline, I should add self. and of course practice makes perfect... and some decent friggin targets to view. find yourself a tasker who works in your favor.. all this is IMO as usual an if PJ puts this thru i'll faint. All the best ~~Terri -------------- Moderator's note: I moderate for *focus*, not opinion. As long as the focus of the email is clearly on-topic, the content is up to the writer. -- PJ Reply | Forward

#647

From: "k9caninek9" Date: Sun Sep 8, 2002 11:58 pm Subject: Re: putting the left foot out the door k9caninek9 > --- In pjrv...liansidorov71" begged shamelessly...) Anyway, I am very > grateful to you all for the > opportunity - at least until you decide to kick me out ;-) My understanding is that anyone who wants to talk about the experience of rv (and is not a known problem case on the lists), is welcome here. You are doing sessions and that is the main and most important point. > Since the primary purpose of this group is to discuss practice > problems (and keeping in mind that I haven't yet had a chance to > take RV instruction with a monitor), Very few people get to use a monitor on a regular basis. Don't worry about it. YOu can still get great data. The monitor can help you get more data and will notice stuff that you might miss in the session. But in the end it comes from you. All the great rvers can do sessions by themselves as well as with a monitor. I think it's actually easiest to learn alone first. It's easier to adjust to a monitor later then vice versa. > I've only done about 10 sessions so far, and I find > that most of the > time I manage to get a correct primary impression/ideogram - Well sounds like you are doing good so far then. > The problem is that I find this pattern to be almost invariable with > me - I know I'm not supposed to look for or accept any conceptual > conclusions or comparisons, but once my mind comes across one I just > can't rid myself of it. Please help! ;-) Don't say 'can't get rid of.' Actually what you mean is that so far after 10 sessions, you have yet to get rid of it. What you describe is sometimes called aol drive or castle building. Everyone has to battle it and I think most people occasionally lose the battle once in a while. You are at least recognizing the problem which means you are paying attention and understanding what is going on. THat is a good thing. The cure is to keep doing sessions and observing problems like that and working it. Slowly you will start to know and control your mind more efficiently during the session and you will gain better control of the aol drive. I know for myself, after being wrong a lot of times, after a while during the session is has become somewhat easier to write stuff down and then forget about it and move on, instead of getting trapped into aol drive and 'forcing' things to appear to fit. Instead, I have learned to become more comfortable when things appear to contradict themselves in the session. A lot of it is just to keep working at it and chiseling away at the problems. You will get there. Ten sessions is not many so sounds like you are doing good so far. Keep up the good work! ;-) -E Reply | Forward

#651

From: Bill Pendragon Date: Mon Sep 9, 2002 1:56 pm Subject: Re: Re: putting the left foot out the door docsavagebill Hi Lian, You might try dropping your pencil and task yourself to drop your preconceptions as it hits the paper, when getting stuck I like to do that. It helps. Or moving on.to a new level...anytime you get a stuck feeling.or resistance. Another trick is "hemisynch" type music that will get you into deep alpha or theta..it seems to soften those compulsions. And allows you to stay with the target longer. Lastly I use finger dowsing to let me know if I'm off on the wrong track. If one designated finger tingles it means I'm on the track..if the other does..I'm off track. This will help you get by blocks.and gives you confidence..but alass sometimes the finger dowsing may be wrong.also ( G nothings perfect).but I think overall it is a very positive indicator. Best Regards, Bill Good Luck, Bill Reply | Forward

#652

From: Weatherly-Hawaii...m Date: Mon Sep 9, 2002 6:00 pm Subject: Re: Re: putting the left foot out the door maliolana Aloha Lian, Well...I do a clearing...after a vivid impression...I write it down and then tell myself to just let it go ...and begin fresh...begin with a clear slate...it gets easier as you go along to 'let go' of these...frequently misdirections...and if they turn out to be pertinent...well then...you have noted them down...and are free to reconsider them later...after you feel satisfied with the amount of data collected... Love & Light & Laughter Mali'o...aka...Dawna Reply | Forward

#653

From: "liansidorov71" Date: Mon Sep 9, 2002 10:16 pm Subject: Re: putting the left foot out the door liansidorov71 Thanks for all the suggestions, guys - I will try to keep them in mind as I practice. I'm just amazed how different one session can be from the next one - usually my first one is the best and then my concentration drops a notch with every new target ;-) Almost feels like adding layers of noise as you get more tired... But if you hit a good session you can almost feel it - the level of consistency and coherence between ideograms is much higher. Well, since half of my AOLs today were pillow-like, maybe my subconscious is trying to say something... damned if I know what ;-) Cheers, Lian

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