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Source Location: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pjrv/
Filetype: Archive. Topic: Remote Viewing. Blocked: by topic detail.
Archive Storage: www.firedocs.com/pjrv/ and http://www.dojopsi.info/pjrv/
Archivist: Palyne PJ Gaenir (PJRV, Palyne, Firedocs RV, TKR and the Dojo Psi.)



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pjrv : Messages : 180-187 of 4038
(http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pjrv/messages/180?) 2006/06/30 21:08:53
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#180

From: "Glyn" Date: Sat Jul 20, 2002 5:48 pm Subject: Re: Inventing Data gebega Offline Offline Send Email Send Email Invite to Yahoo! 360 Invite to Yahoo! 360 Hi, > Have you ever done a whole session, gotten data, and then wondered where > the HELL did all that come from, since it wasn't at the target?! Yes, but I always reassure myself that all that great stuff I picked up in my session that was strangely and conspicuously absent from the feedback... must be round that corner or over the crest of that hill, just out of sight......... ....LOL!!! Seriously, yes I have, on a regular basis actually :-).........and it's usually the fault of me jumping ahead, creating false scenarios and weaving elaborate tapestries out of nothing. The cursed AOL 'overdrive'! I couldn't control it when doing ERV, probably because I couldn't get deep enough (and if I did I often fell asleep), but now I use the HRVG method, and I find that the disiplined structure is helping me. > Well, I know everyone else is probably perfectly omniscient, right. I notice a > surprisingly small number of people who ever admit to anything less than > compassionate wisdom or psychic skill in public, interesting given the small > number of people demonstrating either of those in public regularly, LOL. I guess that most of us don't worry too much about others seeing our bad sessions, because we have nothing really riding on it. We can just get up, dust ourselves off and try again, and we can even feel gratified that we had the courage to share; but noone really minds if we don't have that courage sometimes. Most fellow viewers will give encouragement and advice, and we all can all learn (and have fun) from the exchanged experiences IMO. Like all those at the top of their respective tree, the RV experts aren't allowed the luxury of failure however. It's a shame, as we all know that psi isn't consistent and everyone has bad days, even the very advanced, but the higher the perch the further the fall........and people like me aren't depending on a reputation to make a living. That may well have a lot to do with it. I guess they demonstrate their abilities to their students and to investigators though, ....and surely it would soon become known if they could not practice what they preached. Kind regards, Glyn ------------------------ Moderator's Note: I'm unfortunately real familiar with AOL Drive. I'm not referring to that in my question actually, though it's still worth addressing. AOL drive is when you've gotten data and your 'assumptions' torque it into a given analytical model that causes a filter/interpretation of all future data received as well. I am actually talking about an entire session which seems like a perfectly normal, maybe even pretty decent session, except obviously isn't as it has ZERO to do with the target. No trace of accurate data ever, or assumptive torquing -- and anybody practicing learns to recognize AOL drive at least after the fact anyway, not just on paper but in one's own head and how it feels. Not that. Just... lost. Just a whole session that seems unattached to its own target and maybe anything else. Now I'm assuming that once in awhile this happens and I just invented it totally for some reason. I could invent as many reasons as I invented data in the session, lol. Bottom line, it's just "wrong" after the fact. But it's so disturbing to feel so fine about it, to feel just like it feels when one's pretty sure they'll have a good session on feedback, and have it be so way in the outfield. -- PJ Reply | Forward

#181

From: jsentient... Date: Sat Jul 20, 2002 3:00 pm Subject: Re: Inventing Data jsentient Offline Offline Send Email Send Email Invite to Yahoo! 360 Invite to Yahoo! 360 Palyne mentioned she was a type "A" personality in this post. I am most definitely type "A" myself. What I would like to ask the list is: Is there any RV'ers out there that do not consider themselves type "A"? Palyne, you also mentioned the notion of "forcing" the data reception. My own experience is that intensity and focus can be productive,,,,,,but "force" is not possible. The question here is,,,,,,is RV a matter of effort,,,,,or more a matter of intention / attention? Does RV have a perspiration factor? Or, is the experience predomently passive? J Reply | Forward

#183

From: Richard Krankoski Date: Sat Jul 20, 2002 10:18 pm Subject: Re: Inventing Data Rich_crv Offline Offline Send Email Send Email Invite to Yahoo! 360 Invite to Yahoo! 360 Palyne Gaenir wrote: > Off and on I seem to be coming across this novel creative process in myself > also known as.... INVENTING data. This can "overlap" with some degree of > regular RV so-called 'displacement'. > That sure rings a bell. > Now, the NEXT target had EXACTLY that fountain as described. But I don't > see this as some kind of 'simple displacement'. I don't seem to suffer from displacementitis. I can't recall any instance of it happening to me, even when doing Marty Rosenblatt's ARV project. > Another time, I got a little data about a target.... mostly just over, over, flat, > flat... and when I pushed a little, got that there were white rectangular > structures.... but couldn't seem to get anything else about the target. I was > very frustrated. On feedback, it turned out to be just a big field... at the very > back of the photo you could just make out some white rectangular buildings. > This has been a recurring problem. Just how much can you say about a field, a mountain, a dog, etc. If the feedback picture or statement is simply "the dog", why should you be expected to describe the surroundings? Why would you if you want to describe the target. I see this often in group practice. Every little thing that matches every little perception that "may" be somewhere in the physical area is a "hit". The more feedback is piled on beyond the feedback photo which was suppose dto be the focus of the data, not something that someone found or knew about outside the photo. If that is the case, then the feedback should be written "describe the dog and where it is at and who may be there (the photographer?) and what's outside, etc. > > But I was annoyed that I didn't KNOW there "wasn't much data to be had", > that I didn't grok it was a field, as I was real frustrated during the session that > more wasn't coming -- as it doesn't feel any diff than when I am just simply > not getting much data but should be. > > > I could -- and do -- simply consider that I was just wildly wrong. > That seems to be very hard for many to accept despite that the "best of the best" score a lot closer to 0 than 100. A passing grade in RV is somewhere around 20% +/- a whole bunch. > > Whether it uses some form of psi (the _next_ target, or what you'll see in a > movie later that day, or whatever) or not isn't relevant, if the data's wrong, it's > just wrong, but in this case, it's like you demand something of yourself, and > yourself goes, well, OK (sigh), here you go. > > Well, I know everyone else is probably perfectly omniscient, right. I notice a > surprisingly small number of people who ever admit to anything less than > compassionate wisdom or psychic skill in public, interesting given the small > number of people demonstrating either of those in public regularly, LOL. ;-) Yeah, isn't it strange that in golf you are considered good if you just do par? Or consider darts. Wanna see me hit the bulls eye? Oops.... let's try again... oops...... .... OK, anyone wanna play..... Rich Reply | Forward

#187

From: Weatherly-Hawaii... Date: Sat Jul 20, 2002 11:52 pm Subject: Re: Inventing Data maliolana Offline Offline Send Email Send Email Invite to Yahoo! 360 Invite to Yahoo! 360 Aloha PJ, I don't know the answer but I do know the feeling!...I had that happen a while back and our group was in a tie...I was so positive that mine was right that I tried to get our group judge to go my way(not the usual thing to do...normally a tie just goes uncounted)... Well I was 'off target' and to this day I feel I was 'on target'!...hahaha...I hate that!......But when I feel that certain and I am correct...it seems to mean so much more to my psyche...that I am inspired to go on...I just remind myself how much fun it is...(Even though it is real painful at times as well!)...lot of energy going on...whether on or off target!~ Love & Light & Laughter Mali'o...aka...Dawna pjrv : Messages : 177-216 of 4038
(http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pjrv/messages/177?) 2006/06/30 21:12:05
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#177

From: "Palyne Gaenir" Date: Sat Jul 20, 2002 1:49 pm Subject: Inventing Data dennanm Offline Offline Send Email Send Email Off and on I seem to be coming across this novel creative process in myself also known as.... INVENTING data. This can "overlap" with some degree of regular RV so-called 'displacement'. The first time I ran into this was years ago. I was doing a target and I'd sensed there was some water in it, near the middle. I didn't get any further data about it. I wanted more data. I'm a type-A personality even in RV. (MORE, damn it! - fist-slamming determination. :-)) Eventually, through my determination, I managed to come by data that seemed fairly specific. A fountain of a rather specific type, which I described and sketched. There was not any fountain in the target. Worse, it contributed to AOL drive already existing in the session. Now, the NEXT target had EXACTLY that fountain as described. But I don't see this as some kind of 'simple displacement'. I see it as, I was insisting on data of a certain kind, and for whatever reason, there just wasn't a lot more "mmmph" in the target, so my mind went out and got something else to make me happy. Another time, I got a little data about a target.... mostly just over, over, flat, flat... and when I pushed a little, got that there were white rectangular structures.... but couldn't seem to get anything else about the target. I was very frustrated. On feedback, it turned out to be just a big field... at the very back of the photo you could just make out some white rectangular buildings. But I was annoyed that I didn't KNOW there "wasn't much data to be had", that I didn't grok it was a field, as I was real frustrated during the session that more wasn't coming -- as it doesn't feel any diff than when I am just simply not getting much data but should be. Some time later, The next session, when I sat down to do one, I didn't get any data at all. I did ideograms for awhile waiting for ONE PERCEPTION to come to me, nothing. I kept trying. Eventually I made target contact (...) and did a session and, while I wasn't as close as I wanted to be, felt fairly sure that I had nailed the primary concepts. I went and got a target to assign to the session.... and the moment I picked out an envelope, I knew (the only psychic flash I'd had, LOL!) it had ZERO to do with the session. I was right. In fact in a pool of 900 I'd have been hard pressed to find a target that had LESS in common with my session. :-) I could theorize that in choosing the envelope I did a major example of psi- missing, a psychological sabotage (fear of psi, LOL). I could -- and do -- simply consider that I was just wildly wrong. But maybe it was another example of 'inventing' data. Of insisting on data when for whatever reason I wasn't really in tune with getting it at that moment. A friend of mine tells me that if you aren't getting data and you force it, your mind will basically invent something for you. Whether it uses some form of psi (the _next_ target, or what you'll see in a movie later that day, or whatever) or not isn't relevant, if the data's wrong, it's just wrong, but in this case, it's like you demand something of yourself, and yourself goes, well, OK (sigh), here you go. Maybe it's a lack of demanding the right thing... Or maybe it's the wrong thing to demand data when one isn't really in the mode to get it. I guess learning WHEN one isn't in the mode, vs. confusing that with just not yet being in 'the right state of mind' would help.... Have you ever done a whole session, gotten data, and then wondered where the HELL did all that come from, since it wasn't at the target?! Well, I know everyone else is probably perfectly omniscient, right. I notice a surprisingly small number of people who ever admit to anything less than compassionate wisdom or psychic skill in public, interesting given the small number of people demonstrating either of those in public regularly, LOL. ;-) PJ Reply | Forward

#192

From: Bill Pendragon Date: Sun Jul 21, 2002 4:06 pm Subject: Re: Fear of Psi ..Dream docsavagebill Offline Offline Send Email Send Email Invite to Yahoo! 360 Invite to Yahoo! 360 Hi Palyne, I had a dream about this the last two nights in a row. And I think I finaly figured it out. In the dream I was in a room in a dark sinister city with a very nice person that felt "family" but I did not recognirze. We did not like this city but I told her I found out I could get information that showed the way out of the city to a city of "light". I had found two square lighted window panes( the only light in the gray dark city) that showed information that led to the "way out". Then some sinister force came and tried to take these squares from me and I was back in the room and awoke. The second dream was very similiar but this time I used the squares to actually get out of the city briefly..but the thought came to me.." by using the information on these squares..I've messing up my natural future.." This thought worried me and stopped me and .allowed the dark forces to reach me, .and threw me back into the room again. After waking it occurred to me that I have a hidden "fear" of using psi because it is somehow forbidden knowledge( but forbidden by the keepers of darkness) and they are leveraging their claim with the hypothesis that it messes up my "natural " future. So I need to confront and overcome that fear to go forwards..hopefully in the next dream...:-) Best Regards, Bill ---------------- Moderator's note: Wow! What a dream! Way cool doc. -- PJ Reply | Forward

#211

From: "stanley01420" Date: Tue Jul 23, 2002 7:26 am Subject: Re: Fear of Psi ..Dream stanley01420 Offline Offline Send Email Send Email Invite to Yahoo! 360 Invite to Yahoo! 360 --- In pjrv...ll Pendragon After waking it > occurred to me that I have a hidden "fear" of using > psi because it is somehow forbidden knowledge( but > forbidden by the keepers of darkness) and they are > leveraging their claim with the hypothesis that it > messes up my "natural " future. So I need to confront > and overcome that fear to go forwards..hopefully in > the next dream...:-) Hey Bill.... what is a "natural" future? trypper Reply | Forward

#216

From: Bill Pendragon Date: Wed Jul 24, 2002 8:45 am Subject: Re: Re: Fear of Psi ..Dream docsavagebill Offline Offline Send Email Send Email Invite to Yahoo! 360 Invite to Yahoo! 360 > Bill Pendragon they are leveraging their claim with the hypothesis > that it messes up my "natural " future. > stanley01420 wrote: > Hey Bill.... what is a "natural" future? Hello Mary, I suspect there is no such thing. Best Regards, Bill ------------------ Moderator's Note: So Bill, you're saying that the aspects/archetypes I interpret as parts of myself, you interpret as external dark intent? Do you think your recent 'psychic self-defense' reading inspires this, or was that just the perception you had about it? I'm curious as to how you integrate this into whatever religious or metaphysical model you hold. -- PJ Reply | Forward

#196

From: "Docrose_22"

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