Remote Viewing RV Oasis / PJRV Discussion list archives. Dojo Psi dot com / info
Remote Viewing info page spacer

The RV Oasis / PJRV Discussion List Archives

Dojo Psi Library, Archival Material, Remote Viewing and Psi

RV Oasis / PJRV List Archives Menu

RV Oasis / PJRV Discussion, Yahoo Groups.
Source Location: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pjrv/
Filetype: Archive. Topic: Remote Viewing. Blocked: by topic detail.
Archive Storage: www.firedocs.com/pjrv/ and http://www.dojopsi.info/pjrv/
Archivist: Palyne PJ Gaenir (PJRV, Palyne, Firedocs RV, TKR and the Dojo Psi.? )



begin archive





pjrv : Messages : 331-331 of 4038 
(http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pjrv/messages/331?? ) ?
?1:?1:?8
~~--------ArchivedPostFollows_Yahoo-PJRV_group---------

#331

From: Bill Pendragon Date: Thu Aug 1, ?00? 4:05 pm Subject: Re: ARV docsavagebill Hi Fortune, Having another judge your posts will help for awhile..but probably not permanently. That's my finding. Most people that do ARV do not just one session but ? or more. I also find that ( at the same time? ) looking at the GROUP judging event is another source of displacement. Because seeing your choices match up becomes another pseudo-feedback event. .. PEM me if your interested in how to do this for the groups you work. Best Regards, Bill pjrv : Messages : 369-369 of 4038
(http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pjrv/messages/369?? ) ?
?1:?5:18
~~--------ArchivedPostFollows_Yahoo-PJRV_group---------

#369

From: Richard Krankoski Date: Sat Aug 3, ?00? 10:5? pm Subject: Re: Re: ARV Rich_crv I agree and also wonder what kind of accuracy people are getting with "regular" RV compared to doing ARV. I get the feeling that people think they should be batting 80% or better with ARV no matter how they are doing with "regular" RV . An intermediate or comparison step might be to do regular RV targets and have the data judged against 4 possible targets and get some standard to work against. But wow..... imagine what the displacement factor must be. :? ) Rich > dennanm wrote: > Hmmmmn. But you know, even in regular RV, this can often be the > case; it seems like ARV just expands the chance for failure in some > sense by adding decoys and the future-issue. ARV also increases > the 'strict evaluation' of one's practice by actually requiring > comparison with more than one thing and an actual decision made, > whereas regular RV doesn't. I mentioned earlier a scientist friend > told me that 30% of all data generally applies to 30% of any target > and so, that also could complicate ARV, if targets weren't chosen > carefully... and a session that might seem 'ok' in traditional RV > might be simply confusing or even misleading in ARV. pjrv : Messages : 33?-434 of 4038
(http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pjrv/messages/33??? ) ?
?1:36:04
~~--------ArchivedPostFollows_Yahoo-PJRV_group---------

#33?

From: "stanley014?0" Date: Thu Aug 1, ?00? 7:58 pm Subject: Re: ARV stanley014?0 --- In pjrv...rtune faychild" I cant seem to get the hang of the StealthRV site . Anyone else using it to > advantage for the comuter judging? I can't figure out how to use it either, Fortune. I dunno, maybe it's me. trypper

#334

From: "smitty97006" Date: Fri Aug ?, ?00? 3:56 am Subject: ARV smitty97006 After having practiced ARV twice a day, five days a week for two years I finally gave up in disgust some months ago. Primarily for reasons oft repeated here and on other boards. I worked with a group, alone, with an analyst, doing my own analysis, etc etc etc etc.. This was almost a full time endeavor with me and was taken and worked at very seriously. I experienced statisitically significant, and even incredible strings of correct calls followed by almost equally incredible stings of incorrect calls with all manner of inconsistancy in between. It was a target that just never sat still. As soon as I was certain I had solved the problem, with results to prove it, it would all go frustratingly right to hell for no apparent reason and without warning. I still regularly wrestle with this and why it should be the case at all. To me it's a lot like communism. It sounds so perfect on paper (From each according to his ability, to each according to his need? ) yet it just refuses to work in real life. (Sorry if I offended any of you democrats out there, :-? )? ) I am still driven to find out why though. The answer may prove to be more valuable than a working ARV system in that it might offer a window of insight into the inner workings and mechanics of the matrix itself that we are currently unaware of. My current theory on the problem, at least for today is that it is a non-sensical cue. To roughly quote one of the former military remote viewers... To ask the matrix something like "What did I have for breakfast or did I ride the bus to work" is not going to work as it doesn't make any sense. (I'm sure I butchered that quote but the idea stated is correct? ) What the matrix will give you in such a case is the closest thing it can find. (I may be speaking metaphorically here in regards to the matrix "thinking" but that's another whole large subject best left for another thread? ) My point here is that the data that is being derived from ARV, at least in all my experience, seems very much like what you'd expect from a non sensical cue wherein you are given the closest thing the matrix can find to it. In this case those possibilites, or closest thing to what you're cueing for are: the target that matches the correct answer, the target that matches the wrong answer, a combination of the two targets, the target that is the most interesting to your subconcious, or data on the orginal underlying question, just to name some of the more obvious ones. Now why the matrix would consider ARV a non sensical cue I don't know. But the data that is being returned with ARV cues is consistant with a non sensical cue in many respects and is certainly food for thought. Gene Smith

#351

Date: Sat Aug 3, ?00? 11:44 am Subject: Re: ARV dennanm Hi Gene, --- In pjrv...itty97006" After having practiced ARV twice a day, five days a week > for two years I finally gave up in disgust some months ago. That is a lot of work to put in! I hope it at least helped your regular RV skill, even if the ARV didn't work out... > I still regularly wrestle with this and why it should > be the case at all. To me it's a lot like communism. > It sounds so perfect on paper (From each according to > his ability, to each according to his need? ) yet it just > refuses to work in real life. (Sorry if I offended any > of you democrats out there, :-? )? ) (LOL.? ) I do too, though not nearly as much as people working ARV do apparently. I finally concluded it was a form of self-sabotage not negative, just 'protective' - and that I would have to expand my personal practice to a wider development, a lot of psyche stuff. I could be wrong though. I just had no other answers. > The answer may prove to be > more valuable than a working ARV system > in that it might offer a > window of insight into the inner workings > and mechanics I've asked a few truly good viewers I know over the years, why is this so hard, why do people start in it and then suddenly stop doing feedback targets, or stop working double blind, or get demoralized and quit, lose interest, whatever? - and they always say, belief systems need to be worked out in regards to this, until that happens, sticking with it is hard enough and consistency will be much more difficult. 'Course that's just their opinion, and there might be some other issue. > My point here is that the data that is being derived from ARV, at > least in all my experience, seems very much like what you'd expect > from a non sensical cue wherein you are given the closest thing the > matrix can find to it. In this case those possibilites, or closest > thing to what you're cueing for are: the target that matches the > correct answer, the target that matches the wrong answer, a > combination of the two targets, the target that is the most > interesting to your subconcious, or data on the orginal underlying > question, just to name some of the more obvious ones. Hmmmmn. But you know, even in regular RV, this can often be the case; it seems like ARV just expands the chance for failure in some sense by adding decoys and the future-issue. ARV also increases the 'strict evaluation' of one's practice by actually requiring comparison with more than one thing and an actual decision made, whereas regular RV doesn't. I mentioned earlier a scientist friend told me that 30% of all data generally applies to 30% of any target and so, that also could complicate ARV, if targets weren't chosen carefully... and a session that might seem 'ok' in traditional RV might be simply confusing or even misleading in ARV. Well, this discussion isn't solving anything so far, LOL.... PJ

#4?7

From: Bill Pendragon Date: Wed Aug 7, ?00? 8:3? pm Subject: Re: Re: more ARV ambiguity docsavagebill Hi Palyne, I'll add some more confusion. After some success with ARV that seemed to decay to nonsignificance eventually, and hearing Lyn discuss associative dowsing, I decided to give that a try. After ?5 trials I was hitting 75% of the targets for a significance of p< .00? , but again an accuracy decay started and I drifted down to not significant by the time I had done 100 of them. I've started doing my dowsing differently and again am significant.. but expect the decay.any day now.. LOL. .Until I change things again.. what is it with the need to change?!!! Oh well I'm going to SanDiego for Pru's class maybe I can get some ideas from her. Best Regards, Bill

#4?9

From: "scottrver" Date: Thu Aug 8, ?00? 10:06 am Subject: Re: more ARV ambiguity scottrver Hi Bill, Did your ARV success decay through displacement or just missing? I've not heard of this being a problem. Scott -------------- Moderator's note: I've heard of it being a problem - but usually for psychological reasons (at least that's the assumption? ). The 'fall-off' factor is pretty common in parapsychology science subjects. -- PJ

#431

From: Bill Pendragon Date: Thu Aug 8, ?00? ?:41 pm Subject: Re: Re: more ARV ambiguity docsavagebill > --- scottrver wrote: > Did your ARV success decay through displacement or > just missing? I've > not heard of this being a problem. Hi Scott, Frankly I'm not a good enough RVer to be sure if mine were displacement or not for sure. But I suspect displacement just from the statistics. However, the dowsing definitely was doing its own displacement-like thing. Which was quicker and easier to see. Experienced dowsers have rather elaborate ritual taskings they do to remove "psychic influences" producing erroneous signals. I originally pooh poohed those since I had so much success. But now I'm going to look at them carefuly with a fresh albeit humble gaze. Best Regards, Bill ----------------------- Moderator's note: The big question is, are they keeping out undue psychic influences.... or building themselves a belief system about their safety and success? And if the former, are those influences from 'outside' them, or inside them? Hmmmn! PJ

#43?

From: "scottrver" Date: Thu Aug 8, ?00? 3:?8 pm Subject: Re: more ARV ambiguity scottrver Hi PJ, I've experienced fall-off in random number generator experiments which is typical there. But I've not heard of it in RV or ARV experiments so it makes sense to me that you're correct and it would be psychological - though I would leave open the possibility that it is experimentor related as it has been noted that some are more psi-conducive than others. Scott > Moderator's note: I've heard of it being a problem - but usually for psychological reasons (at least that's the assumption? ). The 'fall-off' factor is pretty common in parapsychology science subjects. -- PJ

#433

From: Weatherly-Hawaii...m Date: Thu Aug 8, ?00? 4:31 pm Subject: Re: Re: more ARV ambiguity maliolana Aloha pj, OK...I admit it!...I am psycho!...hahah...hmmmm I have a wave like action on my stats...and the downward movement ...definately affects my effectiveness... A chronic personality defect of mine ...is to desire ...intensely... to be right/correct/true...and that can be quite a major burden to overcome ...and can be a reward in itself... but to convince my sub... that it is allright with me...right or wrong...on or off target...I really have to get to my higher self ...to consistantly pull that off......I do though ...about 44% of the time(chance at 50%? )...Queen of below chance psi...hahah I first became quite good at symbolic logic ...at one time... for this very purpose...I thought they were paths to truth...and they were in their sphere of the relative...but more than one view is always a must...if for no other reason than to prove our own correct!...hahah...(I was much younger then of course? )...and was at one time talented with math...(also younger years? )...and Science...then I learned about self fulfilling prophecies and Scientism... So like it goes...the more we learn...the more we become aware of how little we know...Hard to get dogmatic over that ...at times anyway...haha. Love & Light & Laughter Mali'o...aka...Dawna > Moderator's note: I've heard of it being a problem - but usually for psychological reasons (at least that's the assumption? ). The 'fall-off' factor is pretty common in parapsychology science subjects. -- PJ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

#434

From: "rvrichrb" Date: Fri Aug 9, ?00? 5:10 am Subject: Re: more ARV ambiguity rvrichrb Hi Bill, I found an article and a 'link' for you that may prove useful in your search for what's causing your decay in accuracy. By the way, I believe the correct parapsychological term for what you're experiencing is called "The Decline Effect"--a well-known but little understood phenomena in parapsychology. Here is the link: http://www.noetic.org/Ions/research/vaughn.asp Within the article is this paragraph: "He also achieved a significant breakthrough in his design of the Psychic Reward software package. He was able to demonstrate a method for reversing the "decline effect" that had haunted many parapsychology researchers. And, he conducted numerous, well- controlled studies showing that his software package really did train ESP abilities. This was a singular accomplishment for which Alan will be remembered for decades to come". I'm going to have to look for this software:-? ) Good luck with your experiments, Rich --- In pjrv...l Pendragon I'll add some more confusion. After some success with > ARV that seemed to decay to nonsignificance > eventually...

// end archive

Top of Page

Remote Viewing info page spacer

RV Oasis / PJRV List Archives Menu

Dojo Psi Library, Archival Material, Remote Viewing and Psi

The RV Oasis / PJRV Discussion List Archives


Remote Viewing RV Oasis / PJRV Discussion list archives. Dojo Psi dot com / info